Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Foreign welcome to the Bottom Line Me podcast where we like to explore different ideas, tools and resources that help title professionals grow and succeed. I'm your host, Ann Allard, and today we're talking about something very vital to our business and that's referrals. It's one of the most powerful tools to grow your business.
Joining me today is Karen Arthur and she's here to share some of her thoughts and ideas on just this subject. Karen, welcome to the Bottom Line Me podcast.
[00:00:40] Speaker B: Well, thank you for having me.
[00:00:42] Speaker A: Great to have you here.
[00:00:43] Speaker B: Thank you so much.
[00:00:45] Speaker A: Well, or to have you back on the Bottom Line Me podcast, I should say. So.
[00:00:50] Speaker B: Love it.
[00:00:50] Speaker A: Just in case somebody missed a previous episode, can you just take a couple minutes and tell our audience a little bit about yourself, what you do at all? Republic title.
[00:00:59] Speaker B: Absolutely, yes.
So I've worked with All Republic or worked for All Republic for a little over 12 years.
And I work in training and education actually. So I call myself the point person of all things education in our region.
And, and so that can be from our easy learning on demand, you know, helping them with that to actual realtor training, actual, you know, escrow, officer training, that sort of thing. So just coordinating anything education.
[00:01:36] Speaker A: Awesome. Well, thanks for sharing that. And I understand that one of the things you like to educate people on is referrals. So I think we can agree that's pretty valuable in just about any business. But in our business, it seems to carry even more weight.
It's not just about getting the leads, it's also about developing that long term relationship or trust. So here's my first question for you. What is it about the nature of this industry that makes referrals so vital to our growth and stability.
[00:02:15] Speaker B: You know.
[00:02:16] Speaker A: Or sustainability maybe a better word.
[00:02:19] Speaker B: And actually absolutely.
You know, with referrals, people want to work with the expert. They really want to work with someone that's knowledgeable. And if you think about our industry, typically you're dealing with somebody's the biggest purchase of their life.
[00:02:37] Speaker A: Right.
[00:02:38] Speaker B: Really? Even if they're, you know, even if they're trading in and moving up, but it's still a very large purchase. And so they want to be sure that they're working with someone that's knowledgeable.
When you're working with real estate agents who are typically the ones that refer people to us, you know, it, it could, it could be a reflection on them if for whatever reason we, we didn't do our job correctly or it was something, you know, know, happen during the process. And so it's A reflection on them that could also cause us to maybe lose a customer. And so there, there's really kind of a lot of key aspects when you're thinking about building referrals, growing referrals, who are your referral partners, and that sort of thing. But then it's also the inside of it of, you know, what can we do to maintain this relationship? Yeah, the one thing that I find with our business is you may be working, and I'm going to use a realtor, for example, but you, your client may be a realtor, and that realtor could be very loyal to you and bring you business.
And if something goes wrong, you may not hear from them for two or three months because you, you know, that may be how often they get a transaction. So you're not even realizing that they may not be coming back to you for two or three months. And then when you go and say, hey, Martha, what happened?
They almost take it offensively, like, I've been gone for three months and you haven't even noticed type thing. So you, you have to be really careful when you're dealing with your referral, but, you know, with your customer base, because you also have to have people in your office understand how important is in those referrals.
[00:04:27] Speaker A: Yeah, very good point.
Let's talk a little bit about strategies, because I think a lot of people think that just doing a good job automatically leads to a referral, but we know that it's not always that simple.
So from your perspective, what are some of the biggest mistakes that people make when they're trying to generate referrals?
[00:04:50] Speaker B: I think one of the very obvious ones is, is that they don't have a plan in place. They just don't have a plan in place. And I think you're right. I think what happens is that people think that, hey, you know, I talked to Mary Jones today and she's going to give me all her referrals and then that's it, you know, they don't take it any further. And I think that you have to have a plan.
I call it a referral campaign, but you know, just some, some kind of a roadmap game plan of how you are going to grow your business with referrals. And then of course, consistency really does matter in this.
[00:05:28] Speaker A: I love plans. I love game. I think step by step. But so let's talk a little bit about the practical side of that. You've worked with a lot of different professionals.
Can you walk us through a referral strategy that you've seen consistently deliver Results.
[00:05:46] Speaker B: I love the strategy where you're dealing, you know, when you're asking for referrals from the people that actually use you, I think that that is, it's helpful on all aspects, but it's very. It's a little easier to ask for a referral when you're dealing with someone that works with you and knows the type of work you do and the type of business you do.
So I think that. I love that part of it. I think the other thing to think about is that you want them to be also open with you.
You know, usually when I go and talk about this referral strategy, it's one thing, you know, you kind of start off by saying, hey, you know, I appreciate you and I know you. You know, we've got a great business relationship. You know, I'm looking to grow my business, you know, that sort of thing.
[00:06:38] Speaker A: But.
[00:06:39] Speaker B: But then you want to ask them, you know, is there anything that I'm not doing right?
If know, really putting you yourself out there. What am I not, you know, is there anything I could improve on?
You know, I use this example when I'm talking, when I'm teaching this.
You know, you might have an inspector that sends you, you know, does, you know, since all his business or he, you know, really enjoys working with you and, and you know that you've got a great relationship. And when you ask him that question, he goes, you know, you do everything great, but. Except you don't answer your emails.
And you can say, you know, you might say, well, you know, email. I'm more of a text person.
And, you know, he may say to you, well, then could you just put that on your. Out of office.
I work better, you know, on your email out of office.
[00:07:27] Speaker A: Oh, what a great suggestion.
[00:07:28] Speaker B: Yeah, just say, you know, don't, you know, you can email me, but I'd rather, you know, I prefer text.
And this particular situation actually came up and so what happened was it worked.
And so she was able then to go back to the inspector and say, oh my gosh, it worked. And I put it in place and thank you so much. You know, so it's kind of fun to watch those things kind of progress like that. But that was, that was one. One way or one, you know, so.
[00:08:01] Speaker A: Simple when you, you know, when you think about it. But who knew, right?
[00:08:05] Speaker B: Yeah, but I think too, the key is, you know, don't take it personally.
[00:08:09] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:08:10] Speaker B: You know, this is part of the thing that when you're talking to that person that uses you and trust you and you Build a relationship with, when they, when they give you that bit of information, take it and learn from it, grow from it. Try to figure out a way to make that work and then let them know if it, hey, if you incorporated something they told you, let them know they're your partner.
[00:08:35] Speaker A: Well, and I think it's really about learning to be flexible. I mean, I may prefer email, but if I have a client that really likes to be able to text something to me and expects a quick response, then I've got to learn how to adapt and be flexible if I want that customer. Yeah. So thank you. That's a great point.
So let's talk, you know, let's talk about somebody that doesn't have an existing, you know, book of business. Somebody that's new or just starting out. And how do you, how would you recommend that they go about building a referral network when they're doing it from the ground up? Basically.
[00:09:16] Speaker B: I think they have to be flexible. And one is get out there and join industry communities, so to speak. So join Women's Council of Realtors and get kind of connected in industry. Join your professional association. So, you know, for, for, for, for me, it's the Texas Land Title association getting involved in that.
But taking it a step further, I think that what they, what's really important too is just making connections.
Making those connections, whether it's at your children's school or whether it's at church, you know, those are maybe the easier places to start, but growing those connections and then being consistent with them. So what I mean by that is if I'm on the PTA for my kids school, I might wear my name badge to let everybody know that I'm in the title business and have them. It allows for a conversation, what do you do? How does that work? And that sort of thing. And so I think that that's very important. I think that you need to be very focused on what it is that you're trying to do. And I think that when, when you're focused, that allows for a, you know, maybe more of a bigger opportunity because you're, you're, now you're focused, so you're paying attention to, ooh, this is a great source of referrals. And this is a great source of referrals. So I think that, I think not getting discouraged, you know, when it's hard not to get discouraged, but I think that not getting discouraged, understanding, you know, this is, this is what I want to do and this is how I'm going to get there. And having Maybe, you know, a strategic plan to do that.
We talk about this in the referral class that I teach a lot. And it's, you know, having your smart goals, having, you know, knowing what it is that you're trying to do and then being able to measure it and being able to, you know, have a time, have a time based and that sort of thing. Because quite frankly, if it's not working, you don't want to spend a whole year trying to do it. You know, you want to make that the. What you're working on is working.
And so having, you know, having that. That plan of attack.
[00:11:45] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. I think, you know, I loved your suggestion. You know, for, for somebody that's starting out to wear something, you know, put a badge on or that's a great use of your company branded clothing, I guess, you know, for somebody that's not really comfortable showing off a name badge, just wearing your shirt that says all the public title could spark a conversation. So that's great piece of advice. Yeah.
So, you know, and as you were just saying, they don't just come from. I don't think they come just from a transaction. So we do get some referrals by transaction. Hopefully. You're always asking at the end of a happy transaction, anybody else, you know, that could use my services would benefit from it.
How important is the relationship building in creating that stream of referrals? Even if somebody refers to somebody. What I'm trying to say here is if I get a referral from Andrew, let's say, and it works out really well, is it important for me to keep going back to Andrew and asking him, is there anyone else in your pipeline or anyone else in your circle of influence or in your network?
What would you say about that?
[00:13:06] Speaker B: You know, that I'm going to say it's a little bit of a loaded question.
[00:13:10] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:13:11] Speaker B: And the reason why I say that is that ideally you don't want to be shy in asking for referrals, but at the same time, you don't want to be that person that just always, you know, what do you got for me? Yeah, what do you got for me this week? What do you got? You know, so you want to be able to, to handle it strategically, I guess, is probably what I would say or what I would suggest. And I think that, I think it's very important to let Andrew know that, hey, I, I appreciate Mr. And Mrs. Jones transaction or, you know, ABC Investment Company's transaction. I appreciate that you thought of me.
I'd love to, to repay the favor or repay a referral back to you and then do that.
[00:13:59] Speaker A: That's a great way to start to build a relate.
Instead of constantly calling Andrew and saying, anybody this week that you can refer me to?
[00:14:10] Speaker B: I think that if you build that relationship and that trust and you build that connection, I think those referrals will come. And I think too, if you, if you talk to them, you know, just ask the question, how do you handle your referrals? You know, it may be that, you know, Andrew handles his referrals by he, he, you know, is kind of a, you know, on a revolving, you know, method where, you know, he, he kind of spreads, you know, shares the, the wealth.
But it also may be, he might be telling you that, hey, you've never asked me for wine.
[00:14:45] Speaker A: There you go.
[00:14:46] Speaker B: And you know, it's like, wow, that's, you know, that's a real light bulb moment. You're like, oh, all I have to do is ask. But you also have to be, you know, you have to do a good job and you have to pay attention. And then, like I said, you really want to reach out with a, you know, a referral back or, or, and even something. Yeah, something let them know that keeps.
[00:15:06] Speaker A: You know, that shows the appreciation but also keeps the, the pipeline or the conversation open and flowing. That's great. That's great. I think that's really important for particularly somebody new that really doesn't have a system, as you said, that you need to set up and it. We can, we can get carried away. If you get one or two great referrals, then you think your go to person for everything is going to be Andrew. So. Yeah. Yeah.
[00:15:32] Speaker B: Interesting.
[00:15:33] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:15:33] Speaker B: And I think too, I mean, it's, it's. We talked a little bit about getting connected with the community and that sort of thing, but it is getting connected with those real estate partners. Partners.
I think that they're so important, especially when you're first starting out. And I think that, you know, you don't have to, you know, you don't have to take them to lunch or I think you could even, you know, offer coffee. You know, just say, I'd love to meet you, Tom, the inspector, Sherry, the, the, the home warranty person. Or, you know, you want to kind of build that where they get to know it's organic.
Yeah.
[00:16:09] Speaker A: Grows naturally. Yeah.
[00:16:11] Speaker B: And I think people really appreciate it.
[00:16:13] Speaker A: Yeah. So. Yeah. All right. But we got to talk a little bit about systems and tools here, so, you know, because it's great to, to do all of those things and be Spontaneous. But, you know, keeping track of all this stuff I think is a critical piece. So do you have any recommendations on how you do that? Is it a CRM tool or some kind of a system that you keep so that you don't lose track of it or you don't get overwhelmed with it or somebody doesn't fall through the cracks? What say you?
[00:16:43] Speaker B: Well, I think that a CRM system is a great way to keep up with it. Again, consistency matters. So you got to enter the information into the system to make sure that you're getting out of it what you need.
But it could be as simple as an Excel spreadsheet or some kind of system that you. A very simple system. And the reason why I keep stressing simple is because the harder that system is, the less likely you're going to enter that information into it. So you want to make that system to where it works for you.
And so an Excel spreadsheet may be maybe your answer, that may be a great way. But if you've used a CRM, that's something that you're used to. You've got a method down where you put that information in at 4 o' clock every day and you've kind of got a time blocked on your calendar and that works for you, by all means, use that. But you also need to follow up, right? So it's. First you gotta make sure you get the information in there. And then secondly, you've gotta make sure that you're looking at it, you know, to see, because you, as you start to build a report, you start to see then what, you know, where those referrals are coming from, you might find that James has sent you, you know, six referrals and Anna has only sent you one. And while we appreciate Anna's one as much as we appreciate James six, it tells you that something about James, whether he's really, you know, he's working hard for you or he's working, you know, whatever the case may be, but it's important to pay attention to those as well. You know, it's one thing to put it in, but you also have to look at it.
[00:18:33] Speaker A: Well, it helps you build your strategy and your plan. You know, you want to thank Anna, but you might want to say, hey, James, let's go to lunch.
This is the 10th time you send somebody to me. That's been a great referral, so I get it. Yeah, that makes sense. You know, so we both agree that consistency is really key, but timing is too sometimes, you know, and I know we've talked already a little bit about how often. But in the courses you teach, do you have any sort of, you know, ways that you say to somebody, okay, at least once a month, reach out to somebody or what. What's the process like? Give us a little bit of the back, you know, the background on that.
[00:19:16] Speaker B: So I, I think starting out, and again, it depends on the person, but starting out, let's just say you reach out to one person per month, and let's say that that one person, you know, you reach out to one person per month for 12 months. That's, that's potentially 12 referrals. And that's, that's. If they only refer one person to you, you may have multiple referrals. But just think about it in terms of 12 transactions.
And you know, I always put a number on it because I just have to know. So let's say that the transaction, the average transaction is $300,000.
You can kind of figure from there that that referral has brought you X amount of dollars in, um. And if you get 12 per year, it's 12 times that, you know, and if that's a, in your area, if that's a low sales price, well, then you, you know, so there's, there's a, there's different ways to do it. But that to me is a very easy, easy way. And if you can just do one, if you think one referral a month, that really isn't very time consuming, it doesn't take you away from your, your job, if you're, you know, you're busy, probably is less than two hours a month when you think about it.
But, you know, that's one of the ways I like to do it, because I can measure it.
[00:20:47] Speaker A: I think that's. Yeah, because measuring these things is always, you know, it's challenging, particularly if you don't have a system or a spreadsheet or something in place. But if you can put a dollar amount to it, sometimes, you know, we're going to be a little bit more motivated than if it was just based on numbers.
[00:21:03] Speaker B: Yeah, absolutely.
[00:21:05] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah. Great.
So I love to, I'd love to know if there's any real life story that you can share with us, because I think they really stick. You know, any example you can share on a situation where somebody sent somebody a referral or referral rose up out of a transaction and what happened and any, anything you want to share on that?
[00:21:31] Speaker B: Well, I think that there's, there's been a couple of times where I have seen a, you know, People have, they've given a referral and they have friendships grown out of it, like literal, you know, where they're going to, you know, concerts together, they're going to eat dinner every Saturday night together, which is really, it's fun to see that. I love, I love that part of our industry because you've got so much in common with people. And then when they really, you know, when you really like to work together and, you know, socialize together, I think that's one, one way, one thing that we're seeing more and more these days is the branding.
So I'm seeing where more and more title agents are branding themselves.
And when they do that, when they're branding themselves and I'm talking about like the individual, they're using personal branding. Personal branding, yes. And so I found that that seems to work really well now. Again, it takes consistency and that sort of thing, but I have seen where that works as well.
[00:22:45] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, that's a, that's a. And that seems to be a theme, consistency. But I think it's true in anything in life.
[00:22:51] Speaker B: I do.
[00:22:52] Speaker A: Yeah, it is, exactly.
You know, I also think that sometimes the best ideas come from some, something that happened unexpectedly.
Anything creative or any really out of the box kind of referral or strategy that you've seen actually work that somebody's tried and you thought at the beginning, wow, I don't, you know, I don't know where that's going.
[00:23:21] Speaker B: I do. I think that our industry, I think society as a whole, but I think our industry has really gotten away from the personal aspect of the transaction.
And so when, when I think back about this being most people's largest transaction, yep, it's great to get a text. I think it's great to get something in the mail that introduces yourself. But I, I feel like nothing works better than a voice to voice is what I call it, but a personal phone call to say, hey, I'm Karen and I'm going to be your processor on this transaction. We're thrilled to have it. I just wanted you to know that I'm your point person. Here's my direct dial number. If you need anything or have any questions, I'm here to help. I see that you're closing on July 31st and everything looks great.
You know, I think when I'm purchasing something for $300,000, for example, I feel like I just want somebody to acknowledge that, hey, thank you, and that we, that we worked.
[00:24:34] Speaker A: We've got you covered, you know, such a great point. But I can't Help but think that now making a phone call is thinking outside the box. Okay. Yes, I know. I guess.
[00:24:45] Speaker B: I know it is kind of.
[00:24:49] Speaker A: Yeah, I agree.
[00:24:51] Speaker B: It's probably, you know, but I. I do. I think we've just lost that.
Yeah, we've just lost it for some reason. And when I go out and talk and I. I speak with realtors and. And that sort of thing as well, and that's the one thing I really hear is, is that they don't know if the title company who, you know, if they got the contract, if anybody, you know, because usually the title company is working with, you know, the realtor in a lot of cases or the attorney, you know, and so for. For whatever reason, we kind of miss that customer or, you know, the buyer, seller.
[00:25:32] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah. They're connecting all the dots in the transaction, all the people instead of dots. Yeah, Very interesting. What a great conversation. So. Well, you know, I love to get a bottom line, so I think we're about. At that time, so let's do it.
[00:25:49] Speaker B: Okay.
[00:25:50] Speaker A: All right. So for somebody listening who might be ready to take some action, what's one simple thing that they could do right now or today to start improving their referral game?
[00:26:05] Speaker B: What you could do today, right now, as we're on, you know, as we're speaking, make a list of people that.
That you work with, that work with you, that you talk to that, like, working with you. You like working with them. Make a list of those people and then get with them and say, hey, I just need five minutes of your time.
I'm working to really grow my business, and I would love to get, you know, some insight from you, but I'd also like, you know, for you, you know, to learn how you handle ref, you know, asking them, but first and foremost, making that list of those people. And then don't be shy. Give them a call, buy them a cup of coffee and meet with them.
You can do it over the phone, but I think sometimes again, here I go with, you know, but I think in person, it's really important they see your. Your passion, they see what you're trying to do.
I think that people have a more, you know, they. They feel more inclined to help you when they can kind of see you and feel, you know, what. What you're wanting to do in growing your business and that sort of thing. So I would, you know, you can do it over the phone. You could, you know, however. But I really feel like, hey, buy him a cup of coffee.
[00:27:20] Speaker A: Yeah, buy them a. You know, who doesn't want a cup of coffee?
[00:27:23] Speaker B: Yeah, buy them a cup of coffee and just ask them those three questions. You don't even have to, don't make it long, you know, ask them three questions, tell them how much you appreciate, you know, their time and then move on. But you got to get started by making that list and then making the phone calls to meet them.
[00:27:39] Speaker A: So great. Well, thank you, Karen.
So audience, you have your assignment. Now make your list.
But Karen, thanks so much for spending some time with me today. This was a really insightful, fun conversation to have with you and I look forward to having you back again.
[00:27:55] Speaker B: I love it. Thank you. Thanks so much.
[00:27:57] Speaker A: Thank you. And to our audience, as always, we thank you for taking some time out of your day to join us. And until we meet again, let's all continue to learn, grow and prosperity.
